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YTA. Wow. Yes, women with curly hair do need a different type of shampoo and conditioner. Dollar store shampoo is likely going to damage her hair. Also, do you not understand how traits are passed on? Was there a reason besides your daughter's physical features that you thought she wasn't yours, causing you to not properly bond with her? You suck, YTA.


He's getting off so easy if she's just using extra conditioner as well!


She may be doing the curly girl method, which uses conditioner a lot more often than shampoo


I'm not and I still get through conditioner. I was referring to some people using multi products (absolutely not me, not at all....)


Yeah I have a shelf full of leave in products, from oils to gels to creams, and like 5 different conditioners at a time. After 30 years of my hair being a mess I decided to take care if it properly. YTA OP. Get her proper products, they dont have to be expensive. Garnier has good leave in stuff for curls, their anti humidity cream is a life saver, it's all around 5 bucks. Conditioner should cost a bit more than that, and yes, she needs alot. Just be a good dad and provide for her


He isn’t a good dad. He thinks his wife cheated and has decided middle daughter is at fault for that so she doesn’t deserve nice things. Poor kid.


And he is so punitive, the way he talk about her "needing to learn her lesson" OP you're teaching her to accept mistreatment and I feel so bad for your daughter. I don't see even one drop of love or care for her as a human being in your post.


Where the F is mom in all of this? Can't she buy her daughter conditioner? Sounds like the Dad "rules the roost" Why didn't she learn to care for her daughters hair? Im disgusted by this post. I hope this poor kid moves out the minute she's 18 and never looks back!


My guess is that OP is the "great decider" of the household. His post could 100% have been written by an emotionally abusive and controlling person. He feels his judgement is automatically superior to everyone else's and it seems he gets a boost from telling them what it is they "really" need. I highly doubt he treats his wife much differently and I'm certain he doesn't handle being told he is wrong by changing behavior and apologizing. I can imagine the chaos in the home if his wife went behind his back and did something he had already said no to.


Grew up in a house like this. We were upper middle class, lived in a brand new five bedroom house on three acres. I was born with albinism, but my stepdad decided early on I didn't 'need' special treatment. I never had my own sunscreen or sunglasses, wearing hats was disrespectful and unladylike. And of course if I wasn't playing outside every day I was lazy and abnormal. In Texas. As you might imagine, I got a lot of sunburns, and a lot of headaches. There's no real way of knowing how much vision loss i have due to light damage, but if skin cancer isn't what kills me, it'll be a miracle. I don't understand parents who care so little for their own children that they won't do the slightest amount of research or put in any thought about what they might need, if it's not exactly the same as everyone else. I mean, as they say, Google is free, and it would take all of thirty seconds to find out that curly hair has different needs than straight hair.


THIS! I feel horrible for her. Hopefully Mom is a whole lot better than this a$$hat.


Right? What's the "lesson" that's being taught here??


That her dad is a stupid asshole?


And doesn't know shit about genetics. If the kid isn't a clone of HIM, isn't his.


Not only do I hope that this girl cuts ties with him, I lowkey hope he needs a kidney someday and this girl is the only genetic match. Talk about just desserts.


Wonder if his wife knows he thinks she slept around?


I'm sure he yells it at her all the time.


And he's apparently never heard of recessive genes.


I agree he hasnt been but he could decide to change


He thinks curly hair is no more trouble to deal with than straight hair. People who think they know things with no evidence aren't easy to change.


This has nothing to do with curly hair and conditioner. He just doesn't want to pay for hair products because he doesn't think this child is his.


My ex *refused* to buy our daughter conditioner for her at his house because she has super long extremely thick hair (which she got from his mother smh) and would go through conditioner like crazy. He's bald and refused to empathize with her or try to understand her hair. He kept insisting that nobody should be going through hair products that fast, especially 8 year olds. I always had to rewash her hair when she would come home and use leave-in products and detanglers on her so that I could brush her hair. I would take her to the hair cutting place about twice a year just to *thin* her hair! Her length would be the same but her hair wouldn't be so heavy and more manageable for a few months before we'd have to go again. YTA OP! Buy your daughter the damn products she needs!


I don't know why he doesn't just go get a paternity test rather than treat this ten-year-old child like shit.


It's not about the Iranian yogurt!


I have a baby sister with curly hair. I have long straight hair and it takes her longer than me to brush it and her hair isn't that long! Though part of that maybe from me brushing my hair at night before bed but still! I love her curly hair but I'm glad mine is straight since it's a pain enough to deal with without curls.




Speaks volumes on his character or lack there of.


And read how genetics work


Seriously. I have green eyes and brown hair, husband has brown hair and hazel eyes (though he was blond as a child) and our daughter has blond hair and blue eyes. My grandfather was Irish with blue eyes and after doing one of those DNA tests my husband found out that pretty much all of his ancestors are from the England, Ireland, western Germanic areas. She lucked out with getting the blonde hair and blue eyes, without my curly hair (which, yes is harder to maintain than straight hair and takes a whole lot of crap to make look good).


No kidding. ExH and I both have brown hair and eyes. Daughter has red hair and brown eyes. Son is blond and brown eyes. Ex always doubted he was their Dad. He definitely is. Turns out we both have Irish, Scottish and English heritage. Oh yeah. My brother has olive skin, black curly hair and green eyes. Until I had chemo I had straight light brown hair. It’s coming back black and curly!!! Curly hair needs a lot of attention. I’m be had straight and now curly. Dollar store products don’t work anymore. My new hair would be a hot mess.


This guy thinks curly hair isn't different from straight hair! Insane. Straight hair is the easy setting. YTA. The reason she thinks you and your wife should have educated yourself on the topic of curly hair is because everything you assume about it is wrong.


Hey, that's an awfully big ask.


He probably thinks it's fake news.


Yes! This is so true! My daughter has curly hair and I shell out a lot of money for her products. But I want her to be used to using products that are needed and I researched all the best products for her hair. Even my daughter with straight hair gets good products for her hair. It's just something that needs to happen.


I have one curly head kid that takes after me, and one that is straight and SO THICK it just absorbs product. My mini gets the same stuff in her hair that I use. She will not suffer the way I did as a child in the 90s with my mama using Pantene or Suave and yanking a brush through my hair every morning, before sending my ass to school with a poofy head and huge glasses lmaooo


Ouch! Yes, see this is the issue for me. I have very straight but thick hair. However, I would easily get tangles because I used to dollar store stuff. I can afford to buy my kids products that work for their hair so why not? No one deserves their hair being pulled from their scalp!!!


SAME! I literally have an entire drawer just for my hair products (mine are 3A/3B) and I've spent nothing short for a small fortune (mostly because I buy a new one every 2 weeks or so) Curly hair products aren't that more expensive than regular products if you buy them in supermarkets/drugstores/local Afro hair shops. I use the Elvive Dream Lengths Curl Hydration for leave in masks and a microfibre hair wrap to keep me from getting it everywhere for about 45 mins when it's wash week Then the garnier hair food/cantu/shea moisture once it's washed out and as a leave in to add definition & bounce & honestly my hair now has this mirror shine that wasn't really hair before Total cost? About [£7.50](https://www.superdrug.com/Hair/Hair-Treatments/Hair-Masks/L%27Oreal-Paris-Elvive-Dream-Lengths-Curl-Hydration-Hair-Mask/p/815131?gclsrc=aw.ds&gbraid=0AAAAADp4mz8CV6MKRNaDUHNfV7VCv4Fde&gbraid=0AAAAADp4mz8CV6MKRNaDUHNfV7VCv4Fde&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIiKOgiovv9wIVKoBQBh1UdgJDEAUYAiABEgKMw_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds) for the conditioner & a max of [£7.00](https://www.superdrug.com/Hair/Hair-Conditioners/Leave-In-Conditioner/Cantu-Shea-Butter-Leave-in-Conditioning-repair-Cream/p/729424) with a min of [£3.50](https://www.superdrug.com/Hair/Hair-Treatments/Hair-Masks/Garnier-Ultimate-Blends-Hair-Food-Papaya-Hair-Mask-390ml/p/784891) & these are both quite thick so they take me about 2/3 weeks to get through So for a grand spanking total of £11- £14.50/ or under $20 this guy is willing to make his daughters life way harder- YTA big time Also for the love of god if you haven't already - get that kid a wide tooth comb/detangling comb


He actually states in the only comment that money isn't an issue, so there is no reason for this unless it ties to the fact that he thinks she isn't his kid since he made sure to let us know that she doesn't look like either side of the families.


And on top of that he doesn’t think he has to learn how to care for curly hair? Learn how to care for your child’s damn hair, doesn’t matter if it’s different from yours. Oh, and the, I don’t think she’s mine bullshit? That’s between you and your wife, stop taking out your insecurities on a child.


Hair products are one of the few things where cheap is not a good choice, if you want your hair not to be destroyed. I have bleached hair and cheap shampoo and conditioner will just not cut it. The other things I spend more money on than cheap/generic include paper towels, shoes and mattresses.


She picked out her own products! She did all the research! And conditioner in a month is not too bad. It was fool-proof, he didn't have to put in any effort, he just dislikes her and decided he didn't want to do the one thing he had to do (buy the products).


I have stick-straight, smooth hair. Probably the least fussy hair type in the entire universe. I still go through a bottle of conditioner per month. Seriously, OP, who the f\*ck cares? Just buy her extra conditioner! Don't you want your daughter to take care of herself and grow up believing she deserves to treat herself to things she enjoys? Sometimes I wonder to myself why so many adults seem to have this attitude of self-punishment and self-restraint around truly pointless, harmless things. But reading this post, it's obvious to me that the reason is because there's so many parents like this.


I have bone straight hair & still go thru conditioner roughly 2:1 over shampoo.


I'm honestly sitting here going "one bottle of conditioner a month is just 12 a year and it isn't that bad?" I don't even know how long my shampoo and conditioner lasts tbh since I just purchase new bottles whenever I'm low or out.


BuT iT's No DiFfErEnT tHaN sTrAiGhT HaIr. I don't even HAVE curly hair and I'm violently incensed by this guy.


I’ve got curly hair and I’m going through double that at the moment (probably more like triple tbh).


I'm actually lucky that I find conditioner too thick and to get it through in a decent amount (rather than slathering on more and more for full long hair coverage) I would water mine down. Perhaps I could offer to send the other half of it over to his poor daughter because it seems like a stranger on the internet cares more than he does. And if I did that, I would totally swap it out for conditioner suiting hers. I can get away with any type of conditioner, but she can't. Also I've got straight hair but I damn well know that hair is hair to a particular head, be it curly, straight, short, missing, long, brittle, thick, strong, whatever. It each takes a particular type of conditioner at the end of the wash to maintain it, nourish it, and love it like hair should be. OP YTA get off your high horse, and take that poor kid out and apologise unreservedly, before you lose her completely. Perhaps dad should start washing his in washing up liquid and see what that does to his and feel how his daughter might feel. I feel awful if she's gone through to 14 years of age and had the nightmare of curly hair brushing like you would do with straight hair and an awful conditioner. Ouch.


I don't even have curly hair, I just have super super thick long hair, and I go through double that too. Like, who the hell can stretch conditioner for multiple months!?


I do exactly this....curly hair needs ALOT of conditioner


I have straight hair and I go through 2-3 bottles of conditioner for every bottle of shampoo I go through.




Yeah, I have curly hair and my hair care products are pretty limited with just specialty shampoo/conditioner, curl cream and leave in conditioner. My hair would be a mess with dollar store shampoo and conditioner.


I buy my 10 year old a $50 bottle of conditioner she goes though pretty fast because she's got curls. To the point when she gets back from her dad's house, we hair mask her hair (leave that in for 20 mins) just to keep her hair functional. She can use less pricey stuff if she hair masks once a week, but STILL. Never once doubted she's mine, even with curls and hazel eyes to my pin straight hair and brown. Because genetics. She got genes from both sides.


Passive aggressively limiting and controlling access to essential hair products (she's 14 what's just conditioner to you IS essential to her) in part because of your own hangups about her parentage is definitely AH territory. Even if your misguided reasoning is correct, you chose to stay in this girls life and be her father. YTA, buy her the damn conditioner


And simple genetics says its completely possible that he has a blond child with his wife as his wife is heterozygous for hair colour and there's good chance he is too. EDIT It is most likely affair child, while my older point is still valid, curly hair is a dominant trait so given that is mother and father both have straight hair, it must be from another individual. It comes to about a 9% chance if one of the parents hasn’t realised they have curly hair (Unlikely), and even more unlikely given that no one in the pedigree showed symptoms of curly/wavy hair EDIT 2 Heterozygous means having two different variations of genes on the same spot on one pair of chromosomes. Like one for light hair and the other for dark hair. EDIT 3 Genetics isn’t as simple as that, but say one of the parents has an allele for curly hair, it’s still only a 9% chance that that child was born (Factoring in the sample size). Additionally, OP says the entire pedigree had straight hair, and even if they had unnoticed wavy or curly hair, it’s very unlikely that OP’s daughter would begin to show such noticeable symptoms since no one else had.


This one right here. Both of my parents have dark hair dark eyes and my father has a darker complexion. My brother has extremely blonde hair and blue eyes, I have dirty blonde hair and blue eyes as well, we are both MUCH fairer than our father. I also have EXTREMELY curly hair, my parents and bother don’t. I’m still my parents kid. Op came out of the gate as an ahole. But to give your child the short end of the stick solely because of your relationship with them (caused by you) is disgusting shame on you as a parent OP. No child deserves that.


Me and my brothers look a lot alike but with different colouring. One brother has straight dark brown hair, very dark brown eyes and tans the minute he gets some sun, my other brother has wavy brown hair with pale skin and brown eyes and I got lighter brown curls with the palest skin and green eyes. If OP and his wife have any family with lighter hair/eyes/curls there's a pretty massive chance that girl is actually his daughter.


Yep. I'm the only ginger in my family until you go looking into the farther branches. Supposedly there's one distant cousin who has 2 ginger kids. I assume his wife is a redhead.


Redheadedness doesn't always express fully, either. I'm a redhead. My sons have dark blond hair and red beards, meaning they are also carrying the trait. They're mine and their dad's, for sure, and he's not a redhead at all.


Has OP told his wife about his theory that she isn't his? He might get an earful from his wife. Curly hair is different or they wouldn't be able to sell so many different shampoos and conditioners for it, lol. YTA big time and are doing your daughter and wife a HUGE disservice.


I can't believe everyone is zeroing in on the conditioner issue rather than the fact that he's punishing her because he doesn't think she's his. \*scratches head


Which pisses me off because even if she isn't his, it's not like she had a choice in how she was conceived?!! What?? No one chooses to be the product of an affair ffs


This comment right here. Jesus, can't even imagine what that poor girl is going through and has no f'ing clue why Dad doesn't quite love her. Total AH. And if the mom DOES realize dad thinks that and treats her daughter shitty, then she is an AH too.


Even if he isn't her bio dad, he's still choosing to be around and he doesn't just get to treat her like shit.


I read the first paragraph and didn't need to go any further. OP is stupid.


Plus it’s not as of these traits are readily apparent on a newborn, when you’d be bonding with them. I have two kids with inexplicably curly hair but they just had wispy baby hair for the first couple years. Eye color can take time to develop too. Edited for typos


He IS double the AH. Just for the fact that he admits that he treats his middle daughter differently because he "has doubts that she's his". Based solely on hair traits and eye color? He does need to take a class in genetics and if he really has any other "proof" that his daughter isn't his, he should discuss that with his wife and not take it out on his daughter. Also, curly hair is very different and dollar store shampoo is not going to cut it. And what lesson is she supposed to be learning? That her dad is an AH who treats her poorly for no reason known to her?


The lesson is "don't be materialistic" and imo it's a chauventist viewpoint. Women get told all the time that they have to look a certain way. Wear makeup to work or else you don't care about your appearance. Businesswomen wear high heels not flats. They're held to impossible beauty standards. Then you get a woman who takes pride in the things that make her feel beautiful, in this case her hair, and she wants to make the extra effort to make it look nice. But then society tells her that she's being materialistic and shallow for focusing too much on her looks and her hair. I do find it kind of funny that if you watch America's Next Top Model they always frame it as a bad thing when a girl freaks out over her makeover. But you literally have a bunch of girls who are being told their looks not only define who they are but their success in their career who are now expected to make a massive change. Forget about what that would do to one's own self-image, when looks matter so much to everyone around you and to your quality of life you can't possibly think saying "it's just hair get over it" is going to fix anything.


He is definitely the asshole, no mistake. I'm also wondering if maybe she's going through it so quickly is not because she's using all of it but that her sisters are using her haircare stuff as well. Like he doesn't even name what haircare products they use or offer comparisons (something like middle daughter got TRESemme because it works while the other daughters use Granier Fructis), where the haircare products are stored (like is all the haircare stuff left in the bathroom available to everyone or is middle daughter allowed to take her stuff into her room to keep it out of reach) or how the relationship is between the middle daughter and her sisters. I find it very hard to see that they didn't pick up on dad's 'misgivings' about the middle daughter, can physically see she doesn't look like them and well kid logic would be the same as this father's logic and misunderstanding of genetics, she doesn't look like us so she isn't. I'd like to know if there's some subtle/not so subtle bullying going here because for a girl to not want to talk to either mom or dad and acting out because of it.


>wondering if maybe she's going through it so quickly is not because she's using all of it but that her sisters are using her haircare stuff as well. 100%! My sisters always saw bathroom stuff as community property. Also -- Lots of people with straight hair actually have waves or even loose curls, but they don't realize it until they start caring for it differently. It's possible one or both sisters might have a bit more wave if they (were allowed to) use better products.


That was the way it was in my household as well. If it was in the shower or bathroom, it was fair game. The only thing we were told not to share was razors and toothbrushes because well, obviously unhygienic. My mom spent months trying to figure out why we were going through shaving cream until she found i was using it to screw around with in the bath. It held its form a lot better than bubbles did in my defense for what my imagination wanted when I was around 6.


THIS. I didn’t know my hair was wavy till I started using curly products and quit heat styling. I was shocked.


If I just wash and brush mine, it's straight, but if I take care of it juuuuust right, I have some decent waves and even the occasional curl. It's amazing how much can change with just some conditioner and a wide toothed comb.


"Lots of people with straight hair actually have waves or even loose curls, but they don't realize it until they start caring for it differently." me: << raises hand >>


Also I don't think a bottle a month is going through it quickly. I have straight hair that only goes to my shoulders and I go through a bottle a month. I think I would go even faster if I had curly and/or long hair.


Seriously! Like if you have doubts then do a fucking DNA test. Or better yet, trust your wife, be a fucking man, and raise all of your kids equally. I have blonde curly hair and green eyes. She can come live with my wife and kids and use our curly hair conditioner.


>Also, do you not understand how traits are passed on? Was there a reason besides your daughter's physical features that you thought she wasn't yours, causing you to not properly bond with her? You suck, YTA. hes such an ass for treating her differently (poorly) bc he doubts she is his, either get a test or accept it - the middle is cruel


Fuck, I have pin straight hair and I go through a bottle of 50$ conditioner a month... This guy is a massive ass, but the dollar store hair products are probably the least of the issues.... are we all just going to skim over the fact that he's treating her like shit because he doesn't believe it's his kid?


This isn't even about shampoo. It's about this dude letting his insecurities get in the way of forming a stable relationship with his daughter. Denying her the things that she needs for her hair type is neglect. He should be buying her the correct shampoo as well as a therapist. YTA


This. Curly hair takes more to keep it healthy. OP can cause massive damage to his daughter's hair. YTA OP


I have some serious difficult hair as well, but not curly (though a bit of a (minimal) wave) and what works for me is the exact opposite of what works for her. Difficult hair is such a hassle to take care of and find what works. Those products (if you can afford them of course) can be such a game changer. Hair is such a big part of your appearance and daily routine, anything to improve upon that can influence your confidence and life by so much that it is kinda nuts.


Plus it’s more than just shampoo and conditioner. You still have to use leave in moisturize to have the full effect and maintain that curl bounce. Costco has the shea moisturizer in jumbo size and other good hair products. Where are the other two daughters and wife doing? even with straight hair, you benefit from having good shampoo to leave the hair healthy and easier to style/shape. Plus let us not discuss the smell good body wash and lotion. I remember as a teenager I wanted victoria secret and bath and body works, you can get great items on clearance or semi-annual sales.


I have extremely curly hair and my mom and two sisters have stick straight Glad my dad still “bonded” with me since I looked so very different I have to use two times as much conditioner especially now that my hair is down my back FFS of all the things to pick a fight over Get some counseling perhaps it’s not too late to keep a relationship with your daughter YTA


>You suck Father of the Year, am I right? /s


Dollar store shampoo may very well be damaging the straight hair too.


>I admittedly am not very close with her because I had doubts that she was mine and I had a hard time bonding with her due to that. YTA. Fix that. >she blames us for her hair being uncontrollable for most of her life because we didn’t learn how to take care of curly hair She's right > even though it’s not different than straight hair Yes it is.


All of this. ALL.OF.THIS.


I honestly can’t even imagine being so ignorant and so cruel at the same time. Father of the year over here! /s


Seriously though. This is borderline emotionally neglectful of OP towards his daughter. As the wavy to curly blonde haired and green eyed daughter of my brunette/redish brown haired parents with dark eyes, I would be distraught if they acted this way. They always made sure to love me and take care of me and my hair and my needs. They make a lot of jokes about me being the milk man's child, but it is all in fun and I never go a day without feeling deeply loved and cared for by both parents. OP needs to get it together and realize he is the problem. He needs to seek therapy and maybe get the girl in therapy too as I'm sure this behavior and resentment towards her, even if not super obvious, has already caused damage to this girl.


My 5 year old has super curly hair, like Shirley temple ringlets. I have very straight hair. As soon as I knew it was more than baby curls I did research, asked hair stylists for advice, and got her the appropriate hair care products. It has made my life easier and my daughter doesn't hate bath time when we brush it (as much). 100% op gets a big fat YTA, learn about your kids and take care of them.


I have curly hair and never learned to care for it. I'm determined to do better for my daughter who has the same type of hair as yours. YTA, OP. She needs the specialized products


The main things I have learned - no such thing as too much conditioner, use it in the shower as well as leave in conditioner afterwards plus use a moisturizing shampoo, and brush it while it's wet! I brush hers in the bath with the conditioner in, and she has told me she prefers the wet brush (it's a super flexible brush that tends to pull strands less)


Thank you! That's what we've been striving for. Never brush that gorgeous hair unless it's wet and with conditioner. Then I run my fingers through after a detangler spray mist. Sometimes I use a curl jam in it, depending on how humid it is. Mine is 19 months and I want to be a good mom. I feel like it's too late for my hair lol


I'd like to direct OP to r/curlyhair and have him get absolutely torn to shreds by everyone there, rightfully so. My hair is tightly wavy to the point of almost curly and even it's a pain to get it not to be frizzy, I can't imagine how time consuming ACTUAL curly hair is! YTA for your complete ignorance and attitude. Be a better father.


Can you imagine the effort it takes to detangle her curly hair with the conditioner restrictions?


I’m usually completely against brigading but in this instance, I’m gunna allow it. Curly Girls. Assemble. (Please don’t actually assemble and brigade.)


One of the first thing I learned in Bio 1 is curly hair is extremely difficult from straight hair, it’s literally shaped differently


Right! Curly hair is flatter than straight hair. My middle school class didn’t believe me, so we looked at it under a microscope 😂


I love it when assholes tell on themselves like this lmao. “Everyone in my family — except that one daughter who I don’t think is my biological child because she dared to have recessive genes…. anyway, if I punish that daughter I don’t believe is mine because of the characteristics that make me think she’s not mine… AITA?” Like, idk about you, but “resenting a whole child for who they are” doesn’t ever seem like a win situation?? OP, YTA, and the fact that you wrote that and STILL posted it tells me you’re not gonna believe it when you get voted the asshole.


Got to love the shock and aw some men get when one kid looks different. Cheating does happen sure but your balls are not a cloning facility.


My kid's dad when my daughter came out with blonde hair and blue eyes. :/ Like me... He demanded a DNA test and I damn near skipped into the facility to see his dumbfounded face. Priceless.


I’m the only one in my family with hazel eyes and curls. Reading op talking about the straight hair thing I knew where it was going. Poor op’s daughter. Must be really fun to grow up with a father who thinks you are an affair baby. Edit: also sorry your baby daddy did that. It’s ridiculous to think a baby is going to come out looking 50/50. My high school friend went through this because he didn’t come out looking as Asian as the dad wanted. The more Asian looking daughter was the golden child.


They are LITERALLY her parents which means its their JOB to teach her that shit. The fact he doesn't think so is mind boggling


OP is aware paternity tests exist, right?


Do we want him to be like that guy who [paternity tested his middle son](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/qwgtp5/man_gets_a_paternity_test_on_son_because_he/), found out he's actually his, and then basically nuked his whole life?


Actually, yes. First and foremost, I want people to quit abusing their children for any reason. But barring that, I want divorces and no custody or visitation for everyone who treats their child poorly because of not understanding genetics.


YTA Curly hair _is_ different from straight hair, and even the most basic of research will tell you this. And it is more difficult and more expensive to take care of.


Yep, as a curly girl, I've always gone through conditioner faster than shampoo. OP's ignorance is ruining the girl's confidence. YTA for sure!


My hair is only wavy and I go through conditioner faster than shampoo.


I think I need to start using more conditioner…


I've got suuuper straight and very thick and course asian hair and even I go through conditioner way faster than shampoo. Since shampoo lathers so easily I don't need much, but conditioner just sorta stays creamy so I need more. Fun fact: it didn't matter what hairstyle I had, I always went through conditioner quicker. (I've had hair down to my butt, middle of my back, shoulder length, bobs and even a pixie with shaved sides. Currently growing it back out and my wallet is suffering bc i got so used to just needing a dime of each with my short hair.)


As man who has always had short hair its.....its really not hard to realize curly hair is not the same as straight hair. And im having a hard time understanding how OP doesn't realize this.


You'd be surprised how difficult it is for some! My husband has short straight hair but our son has curly hair - not the same curl pattern as me. At first, Husband argued with me that our son did have curly hair until they started showing properly. Now after 4 years, he's finally remenbering there are some steps he needs to learn to care for his son's hair properly.




Starts off the convo with “I’m sure she’s not mine” likely because of the hair. Then tries to justify why he feels she shouldn’t take care of it/is greedy and wasteful. Forget conditioner. This family needs group therapy.


I feel like this post is fake. It’s checking off too many boxes.


You never know, some people are actually this stupid.


I remember there was one dude who wanted a lady to take paternity test because he wasn't sure if it was her baby.


Remember the guy who thought periods came out the butt then got mad when his girlfriend told him otherwise? Like he keep arguing that it was different for other women, then he was mad she laughed at him.


I’m an attorney who works in family law and let me tell you, even if this one is fake, there are absolutely parents like this.


He slept through biology class, and has no clue that the traits he finds so suspect are recessive.


Chauvinistic and misogynistic men have some egotistical need for their kids to look like them.


My TA and his siblings all had blonde hair but neither of his parents nor his grandparents had blonde hair. It just jumped 3 generations (or more) to present in all 3 kids.


My SIL is blonde blue eyes. Husband and his parents brown hair and brown and hazel eyes. She gets it their grandmother and her other female cousin from the same side is also blonde blue eyed. This OP is an idiot.


A perfect comment for this; bet OP will ignore it, as he knows better about everything than anyone else. Poor girls-all of them.


YTA. Curly hair is NOT the same as straight hair! And you know this, you're just being vindictive. If you feel she's not yours, then address this with your wife. Don't take it out on an innocent child. Also, get some therapy.


100% this. Passive aggressive misplaced anger. The kid had nothing to do with it either


She is going g to dissappear one day and op will be surprised pikachu face.


Considering OP doesnt have much a bond with her, I really doubt he'll care. Also I wonder why if he really doesnt believe shes his, why not get a DNA test? Like seriously, wtf is wrong with him YTA OP, and an absolute idiot.


Definitely strikes me as the type who will care if she becomes successful and has money later on in life. Sadly seen it before.


For real. I wanna know when he started having doubt that the girl wasn't his.... cause if it was within the first 4 years of her life and he still chose to have another kid with the wife, he has bigger issues. 🤦🏼‍♀️ Edit: the way I worded it low key originally kinda sounded like I meant had a kid with his daughter and that's definitely not what I intended.


YTA. First of all, even if she wasn't yours, it's a dick move to blame a kid. Second of all, you said you weren't poor and what she needs isn't so expensive, so what's the problem here? Would it kill you to buy what your daughter needs? Just wow. I wonder what other things the poor girl has to go through if you're making such a big deal out of fucking conditioner.


> Second of all, you said you weren't poor and what she needs isn't so expensive, so what's the problem here? This right here. If you were poor and pinching pennies to feed your family, I might sympathize with you OP. But you are not. So why make CONDITIONER your hill to die on? You say you want to teach her a lesson, but I'm not even sure what lesson you are trying to teach here? YTA.


I think the lesson would be “have less curly hair and look more like dad“. Easy-peasy.


I’m guessing dear old dad hates her hair since that is what made him think the poor girl wasn’t his daughter. So he hates having to get any special items for the hair he hates. The dude has issues, he’s punishing his daughter when she’s completely innocent.


The lesson? "I hate you and I want you to be ugly." That's certainly the lesson she's learning.


There's no lesson he's just being a vindictive Ahole on someone he has power over over a perceived slight against him.


This poor child, who's father doesn't love her equally because she doesn't look exactly like him. My heart is broken for this girl. OP, it would be so easy for you to give a damn and google the differences. YTA


"...learn her lesson" about what? What "lesson" are you trying to teach here? The conditioner she needs to be able to manage her hair is expensive? Or is it really just that you're a cheap-ass who treats his middle daughter like crap because she doesn't look like you? If only there were somewhere you could learn about genetics and curly hair.... **YTA** ​ edit: typo


Teaching her the lesson that she is lesser than her sisters and doesn't deserve healthy hair. YTA, OP.


And that she can't rely on her dad for anything.


Yeah, she is undoubtedly going to learn a lesson from this, just not the one OP thinks.


That was the part that I was confused with as well. The rest was a pretty clear YTA, but that part had me trying to figure out what lesson was she supposed to learn? That people with curly hair do t deserve to have it look nice? That people with different colour eyes and hair than their family deserve to be punished for it? The only “lesson” I learned from reading this is that OP is a dick and that poor girl is gonna run fast and far away as soon as she is old enough. And for the rest of her life every time she buys conditioner she’s goi g to remember her dad and what an asshole he is.


I’m thinking the lesson is “If you disrespect me (even though I’m a GIANT AH who was dismissive and vindictive and disrespectful to you first) then you’re going to get even less from me than the crumbs I was already tossing your way.” So…yet another dick move that proves OP to be the AH.


I think the lesson is “Don’t ask dad for anything. He’s still not sure you’re his daughter and he’ll never stop punishing you for it.”


His daughter is never going to forgive him for his lifetime of neglect and punishing her for her different looks. I wouldn’t be surprised if she cuts off contact when she’s finally free from his authority. And he’ll deserve it.


INFO: Are you poor? Is money really tight for you?


YTA >I admittedly am not very close with her because I had doubts that she was mine and I had a hard time bonding with her due to that. Go to therapy. You shouldn't be taking your issues out on a child. >she blames us for her hair being uncontrollable for most of her life because we didn’t learn how to take care of curly hair, even though it’s not different than straight hair Yes, it *is* different than straight hair. Curly hair has more mass and surface area than straight hair of equal length. Ergo, more and specific conditioner is necessary. >I think she needs to learn her lesson. What lesson? That you're prejudiced against her for being different? She already knows *that.* 🙄


He’s lucky she’s only using shampoo and conditioner. I have a clarifying shampoo, conditioner that I also use for co-wash (and use mounds of every wash), a hair mask, curl activator, curl custard, oil, heat protector and curl revitaliser. Plus all the “tools”! Detangle brush, Denman brush, hairdryer with defuser, satin pillow case, satin scrunches, special towel. As a fellow curly girl OP makes me so angry! Growing up as the only curly in a house of straighty-180’s it took forever to work out how to look after my hair. OP’s daughter is way ahead of the curve (ha, accidental pun, but loving it), especially as she’s going solo with it, and her request is completely reasonable. Some curly hair products can be Uber expensive. If she’s found a reasonably priced one that works for her just get the girl her conditioner! OP taking out his insecurities on an innocent 14 year old, who has probably felt his distance her whole life, is just the saddest thing ever. OP, you’ve got two other daughters, so it’s seems you’re fine with pushing one aside, cause hey, you’ve still got two right? Your middle child only has one Dad. And unfortunately for her, it’s you. I’m so desperately sad for her right now. What an unmitigated disappointment of a father you must be.


Yah this guy takes the cake for worst parent of the day award. YTA.


YTA Stop punishing her and treating her differently because you think she might not be yours. Do a DNA test and maybe have some therapy.


OP clearly doesn’t remember any high school biology because he doesn’t get recessive genes at all.


Exactly, my son looks completely different from boyfriend and I other than his face shape. He has light brown hair that looks blonde in the sun, and blue-ish gray eyes, and super pale skin. Im tan, dark brown hair and eyes so dark theyre nearly black. Boyfriend has black hair, brown-green eyes, and pale skin but not too pale. But I know for a damn fact my son is ours, not only because I know Ive only ever been with my boyfriend; but also because Ive taken biology class and had to study recessive genes. Its not even a complex thing to understand.


YTA for a number of reasons: 1. Curly hair is different than straight hair. 2. You apparently don't know how genetics work and assume that your child isn't yours (did you do a test to see? Talk about it with your wife? Or did you just assume and hurt your relationship with someone who is biologically your child?). You can pass down different traits that don't usually show up but can become active under the right circumstances. For example, everyone in my family has green or blue eyes, but I have brown eyes. 3. I'm a dude with shortish straight hair, and I go though a conditioner bottle in about a month and a half. Someone with longer hair or curly hair I could totally see powering though a bottle in a month. 4. In some of your comments, you said that you aren't poor, can afford the product, and it isn't an expensive product. Are you just too cheap to spend a few extra bucks a month to make your child happy?


Long curly hair here, lasts me three weeks if it's the large bottle, normal sized maybe a week and a half. If they were poor I'd understand l, my dad bought us the dollar stuff because thats all we could do and I understood. If not, then he's TA. The part about treating her differently makes him TA.


YTA - do you know anything about genetics? Or hair care? If you can reddit, you can google and look up curly hair care. You are more than an ass.


YTA Curly hair IS different from straight hair...I mean, it's clearly different. Like, use your eyes. I use 3x more conditioner than anyone I know because my curly hair needs it. If this is real, you are such a jerk for "not being close" to your middle child because she's different.


Yeah... I have curly hair down to my ass. I go through an entire liter of conditioner about once every 2 months and I only wash my hair 1-2x a week. I laugh when I see recommended product usage amounts on stuff. I think my Olaplex says to start out with 2 pumps? Yeahhh no that’s about enough to cover 2 inches of my hair.


YTA. It's obvious you're punishing your daughter for being 'different' than your straight-haired golden children. Even if she wasn't yours, that would be no fault of hers. (I can't believe I had to type those words). Get your unresolved issues resolved in therapy and stop taking your resentment out on an innocent child. And ffs, do a 30 second google search on how curly hair is more difficult and expensive to manage than straight hair.


YTA. Is curly hair different? If only there was a place you could look that up?! Oh, right. There is.


Who can make a bottle of conditioner last 2 months?? I have naturally wavy hair and I NEED a good quality conditioner or my hair actually breaks off. YTA. Seriously a great big AH. You doubt the child is yours so you take it out on the child - YTA. Massive AH. Should’ve gotten a DNA test or divorce when she was a baby, you can bond with her now you know. So a guy with straight hair decides that a person with curly hair doesn’t have different hair needs than him, because of course he never experienced her struggles so they aren’t real. Where have I seen this thinking before………. Ugh YTA.


YTA curly hair requires different treatment than straight hair if she wants to keep the curls nice, do some research and help her out.


\> we didn’t learn how to take care of curly hair, even though it’s not different than straight hair Wrong. YTA. Get your daughter the supplies she needs to manage her hair. Do your job as a parent and stop being lazy and cheap.


YTA. Curly hair has very different needs than straight hair. Don't take out your insecurities on your daughter just because she doesn't look like the rest of you.


YTA. Curly hair requires products specifically designed for curly hair, and she needs to use more product in general to maintain it. Curly hair is more work and money to maintain than straight hair, that’s just the way it is. That is not her fault, and you are required to provide her with the products she needs. I’ve got curly hair and my bottle of conditioner does not last me months, it is one of my biggest investments. I also go through curl cream pretty fast too. BTW. Curly hair is different from straight hair. It does not retain moisture like straight hair does. It has a somewhat different texture, and requires different products and brushes if you want it to be healthy and manageable. You also cannot brush it through after it has dried in case you are like my mother “here’s a hairbrush, brush your hair, it’s messy, it looks like a rats nest, blah blah blah.”


This feels fake.


Sure hope so. But if not, the OP will have a nice reminder in life of how, why & when his relationship shit the bed with this kid.


Definitely. Feels like rage bait


I’ve seen several people comment this and I honestly have no idea why. If you work in family law you see stories like this constantly. Lots of men punish their own children for not being little reflections of themselves. You see it with women as well, but far less often.


yta you are treating her like she is not yours taking your doubts out on her how dare you you are treating her different from your other children whats wrong with you


The money isn’t an issue, your doubt and resentment are. If you are so concerned you should get a test, but also if you were so convinced she wasn’t yours, why did you stay and have *another* child with a wife you believed to have been unfaithful? You’re punishing a child for something she has no control over when you have entered and stayed in an agreement to be her dad. Grow up and honor the contract that you decided to stay in even after having an opt out opportunity. Curly hair is different and does require more attention and product to look nice. Her hair is going to be something that people judge her by as it’s one of the first things about her that they’ll see. You’re a grown man, would you have been interested in the girl in high school with frizzy as hell hair? Probably not. If you would have looked at her differently just imagine how badly the other high school girls will treat her for having poorly cared for frizzy hair. YTA


It's obvious you're punishing your daughter because you believe she's not yours all because you don't know how DNA and recessive genes work. And I'm sure this isn't the first time you've denied her something just to spite her. YTA


YTA. My son has curly hair. It does need different products. Buy her what she needs.


Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Yeah dude, YTA


The daughter's gonna get a job in the next two years specifically to buy the product she wants and she's going to begrudge her parents every minute she's working


YTA. my hair is curly and I go through conditioner way faster than I do shampoo. you should be more understanding of your kid and try to see it from her perspective rather than assuming she is wasting your money.


YTA but not for the conditioner. You're worried about her use of conditioner mean while you say you have a hard time bonding with her because you think your wife cheated!!!! That's the issue that needs to be resolved. Its not fair to your daughter.


YTA. Her hair does require a different routine than straight hair does and stop treating her like she’s less than. It’s not her job to make you feel better. It’s not her job to accommodate your feelings and make herself fit into a box she doesn’t fit into just so you don’t feel inconvenienced. She researched and found a brand with a decent pricing; that’s perfectly reasonable and hardly demanding. Sit down, research curly hair and be amazed at how much work it takes to maintain. And stop making your feelings her problem. She’s a human being. You don’t get to make her smaller cause you suspected your wife did the nasty with someone else.


As somebody with straight hair who has a daughter with curly hair, they most certainly are different. And I don’t think a little over a month is that unreasonable unless you got some super sized bottle. That said, you can often find store brand versions of more expensive products that have the same ingredients. Maybe a soft YTA. Edit: Changing to straight up YTA. I thought what you said regarding questioning if she was yours and such was pretty AH-ish, but I focused on just the conditioner issue itself. But others have pointed out that your concern over her paternity likely has a lot to do with why this is such an issue for you.


YTA. Curly hair is wildly different from straight hair. Also, Walmart sells DNA tests now. Get one so you can quit being such a jerk.


YTA Complete and utter YTA. Curly hair is very different from straight hair. You have straight hair, you have done no research on curly hair, and you're trying to impose what works for straight hair on someone with curly hair. IT DOESN'T WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do your homework. I suggest you start with the book "Curly Girl" by Lorraine Massey. Easy to get from the usual online shops for books, and your public library may have a copy. You can also search online for natural curly hair washing methods. She's not the one needing a lesson, you are.


Fuck the hair question. YTA, such an asshole, with this: "I admittedly am not very close with her because I had doubts that she was mine and I had a hard time bonding with her due to that." That is so damaging to a child. Poor girl. Given how much she is eventually going to have to pay for counseling when she escapes you, buy the stupid shampoo.


YTA. Idiot it is different than straight hair - Coming from someone who’s parents ruined her hair


YTA - I will speak as a person with very curly hair - LISTEN TO YOUR DAUGHTER. You HAVE to educate yourself about the different between treatments for different kinds of hair. Curly hair is NOT THE SAME as straight hair at all. It is NOT. All hair types are NOT the same and are NOT treated the same. To keep my curls healthy I usually have to buy a new bottle of special conditioner and other creams and oils every two weeks. She's not wasting it. She is using the amount she needs for her hair to be healthy. EDUCATE YOURSELF. She doesn't need to learn any lessons. You need to be a better parent.


Your daughter is right. Apologize and buy her what she needs. Stop being cheap before you ruin her hair. YTA


YTA Everything she said is on point. Curly hair needs moisture. Not to mention it tangles easier so the conditioner helps prevent knotting, breakage, etc. Parents thinking curly hair can be managed like straight hair are completely clueless. You should be glad she's working it out for herself since you've never tried. Also, because she doesn't look like you, you think she's not yours, and so you're not close to her? Whether she is or isn't is not her fault, but way to make her feel loved.


YTA I have curly hair. You cannot treat it like straight hair and curlies do go through a lot of conditioner. We also need other products like leave in conditioner or curl cream, mousse or gel. Our hair is more fragile than straight hair and dries out much faster. Dollar store products are junk for curly hair and she will end up needing a half bottle of conditioner each time. Are you on a small budget or is it because you don’t like her so you won’t meet her needs. You said some pretty shitty things about suspecting she isn’t yours. You can have different hair textures and eye colors in the same family. If you don’t understand how that works, maybe you should study it.


YTA. First, just admit that you treat her differently because of how she looks. Second, ONE google search explains that curly hair tends to be drier and needs more conditioner. Third, she’s right. You didn’t learn how to care for her curly hair because you didn’t want to. You’re a bad parent and you’re a bad person.


YTA, for this: >I admittedly am not very close with her because I had doubts that she was mine and I had a hard time bonding with her due to that. It's pretty sick that you've gone 14 year holding these resentments against a child who had no fault in the matter and just needed her dad to love her. The conditioner fight is a symptom of a larger problem that roots back to the way you've treated her for her entire life.


You don’t even have to get to the shampoo and conditioner question. Just your pre-amble makes you the asshole


YTA. If you don’t have curly hair it’s hard to understand that the type of shampoo and conditioner make a HUGE difference. Buy her a deep conditioner in ADDITION to what she wants and have her use that every 3-5 days. Dry hair= frizz, which is the death of curls. Don’t get me started on styling product.


YTA. Curly hair is different, and if you don't want a lot of breakage and split ends, you absolutely must use conditioner and likely more than straight hair.


YTA. Way to fuck up your relationship with your kid. Curly hair is more delicate that straight hair. It does need better products to be used on it in greater quantities. I suggest you do some damn research both on how genes work and how to properly take care of curly hair


This is so perfectly exactly how to be an asshole to a child with curly hair that I don't believe you.


YTA. Curly hair IS different and needs to be treated as such. Curls are high-maintenance and everyone's curls are slightly different so it takes a long time to find products that work. I promise she's not being vain, this is a self-esteem issue. She really does need a ton of conditioner (the curls get dry and frizzy) and she does really need nicer products. Cheap conditioners and shampoos have ingredients that are damaging to curly hair (sulfates) or cause build-up which makes your hair look greasy or limp. I used cheap hair products as a teen and it caused a fair amount of hair loss that reversed once I used better products. It may be worth asking her about her experiences with having curly hair especially in a family that doesn't have it, and genuinely listening. Having hair that's different and hard to manage is a very sore topic. I remember every negative comment from my parents or friends when I was younger and still trying to figure out how to manage my hair with no help and cheap/bad products - it can be pretty hurtful and made me feel pretty "ugly duckling" sometimes. I'm still self-conscious about my hair to this day. The one good thing I remember is that my dad liked my curly hair and would get a little sad when I straightened it (in contrast to the dozens of people telling me to just fry my hair straight every day and I'd look prettier that way.) I would guess your daughter has similar stories and it could be a good opportunity to bond with her by having a heartfelt discussion about how she feels, really listening to her, and then maybe taking her out to get some nice products for her hair or asking her to teach you about her styling routine. It'll make a world of difference to her.


YTA - curly hair is different! Stop punishing her because you think she isnt yours. Get a test and find out if you have too but remember she didn't ask to be born!


If you really didn’t think she was yours why didn’t you just get a DNA test? You could’ve easily just done one by yourself when she was young


YTA and wife is TA too. Neither of you learned that curly hair is different? No one thought to teach her how to look after herself properly- now you’re punishing her for it?? Ewwwww