T O P
pehpers

Big zam


Lasojuri

Remove the malnourished torso and replace it with something sturdier.


MS-06_Borjarnon

I've always felt like the skeletal look of them makes them sort of more... demonic-y? Like, they're a bit reminiscent of hungry animals, which is a bit neat. That said, yeah, in practical terms, you're gonna want to cover up all the important bits.


sinepynniks

Still find it weird why they don’t cover up the torso with any armor


Chuuchao

There are official pre-calamity war designs of the barbatos, kimaris, and the flauros and they have torso armor. I assume it has something to do with the lore of the calamity war or just a plot hole where the gundams suddenly not have torso armor.


Lordgrima5

If you are talking about that image with that proto kimaris and barbs ? those were concept art to decide for a main design for the mechanical design of the show. They ARE NOT Official pre-calamity version


MS-06_Borjarnon

Yeah, that's a particularly common misconception, I think.


MS-06_Borjarnon

Those aren't "pre-Calamity War designs". For one, they're early design ideas, from during the process of creating the series. For another, I'm pretty sure the Gundams were made *during* the war, for the purpose of defeating the MAs.


Boyoboy7

In IBO world that is probably not much issue, because a stray projectile would not be able to destroy the frame easily due to their lack of fire power. The thing about IBO MS is they try to make the MS to be as light as possible due to the meta of their war being focused in melee demanding high mobility. Maybe also because the torso in IBO Gundam could move independently instead of being connected to the hip? I mean like how human could twist their torso without moving their hip or crouching their torso up and down, MS usually has torso completely connected to hip. If that is the case then armor on waist would restrict that feature. Just a theory though. Basically that thin hip is meant to act as spine so the Gundam could move more like living creature than normal MS.


shiboshino

Doubling down on this, when Kudel piloted the gundam Gusion, pre rebake, he used heavy armor and human shields as he didn’t have the Alaya-Vijnana system implanted. He simply couldn’t compete with other pilots mobility wise, which is why he covered up the stomach stalk on his gusion. That said, mcgillis didn’t have the Alaya-Vijnana system either, and he still had incredibly light armor on Baal. I like the exposed frame on ibo suits, the mechanical design in IBO is impeccable in terms of “realism” lmao


Worfrix426

no mcgillis did he installed a more finished version of the alaya


Wolfred240

McGillis did have Alaya-Vijnana system after using Ein as a test bed for perfecting the AV system for adult implant since the knowledge how to has been lost since the end of the Calamity War. Ein was merely a guinea pig for McGillis to use to study and learn how to perfect the Alaya-Vijnana system so that he can have one too to pilot Bael as seen in season 2 when McGillis faction of Gjallahorn commenced a coup' against Gjallahorn. I do agree that Kudal was aware of the Alaya-Vijnana system being complicated hence why he bulked Gusion's armor waist.


226_Walker

Not to mention IBO frames don't really need the torso armour. One of the thing people forget is P.D. mobile suits are just built different. We've seen a [damaged grunt suit re-enter atmosphere mostly intact](https://youtu.be/QdvvNQ2yVVs?t=632), and that was with another mobile suit of the nearly the same weight standing on it and using it as an ersatz heat shield. Torso armour would would impair their mobility without appreciable advantages.


OrphanAxis

It may have to do with mobility, and the fact that the material that the frames are made of is highly durable, enough so that we rarely see the actual frames heavily damaged without something like the valkyrja blades, hashmal's tail, rex's claws; all a golden material that could be summized as something rare that can damage the frames. The Gundam frames were made to be highly agile and work with the alaya-vijnana system, and with that level of agility, dexterity, and spacial awareness it may have been more effective to give them a wider range of motion and less weight in armor. At least, that's my theory, though it may just be an aesthetic choice and a way to depict a very plausible range of motion between the upper torso and legs. Perhaps inspired by a drawing technique used the world over, one which has the artist draw the upper torso and hips and legs separately, and then connect them with the abdominal area last. I'm unfortunately forgetting the name of the book(s) and artist who pioneered the technique which is named after him.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

I can already imagine the actual thing being sliced in half already


god_of_storms

They resist beam weapons surprisingly well


zzkigzz48

Only where there are armors with coating


Cpt_Apollo_

No the entire frame itself is made up off material that resists beam attacks (nanomalite was it?), that's why they resorted to violence and used heavy ass weapons to beat the fuck out of ms'


zzkigzz48

Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't remember seeing it written anywhere that the frame itself is made from nanolaminate. And how can the frame be made from it if it's just a form of coating?


chocolate111592

They have that coating but they can absolutely be destroyed by beam weaponary if they get hit multiple times directly, the frame might survive but the person inside would be roasted alive.


Immediate-Hearing534

Nope the frame of ibo's mobile suits are built with an extremely durable metal whose name has never been mentioned, while the nanolaminated armor is simply a special paint applied to the armor of the mobile suit that works thanks to the ahab particles


HotZilchy

only the actual armor, I don't think the inner frame can resist it


nimbusconflict

Right. The NLA is beam resistant. The frame is impact resistant. I'm surprised they still use NLA after beam weapons stopped being used.


BlazingTrojan

NLA is very defensive against physical attacks as well, so having it on external armor is not a bad idea in providing even more durability.


Cpt_Apollo_

Yeah, Riden-go survived hashmal's big beam fucker


god_of_storms

And that wasn’t even a Gundam Frame


chocolate111592

Yea but he would have been out of there if he got hit again


Deamon-Chocobo

Considering the only Gundams to add armor to that area were the Gusion and the Dantalion Perfect Cowl must mean that that section is already incredibly strong, probably made directly out of the Rare metal and not the Alloy, and that the Mobility/Maneuverability granted outweighs the defensive benefits covering it up would gain.


puffnstuff272

Counterpoint: it would look cooler


KkuraRaizer

This is what I’m thinking too, could keep the moving pistons tho, I think they look cool.


river_boy

This more than anything has always bothered me about their design


Masterdavis

The waist connection between the cockpit and the hips. I never liked that half the mech and the weapons are connected to the torso by a single curved support beam and some pneumatics.


Nameless49

Yeah, same. I always thought it was a weak point especially if piloting them on gravity. All the weight in the torso, backpack, arms, weapons, etc. is going to stress that small abdomen part.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Always liked the style, but that never made sense to me


Cpt_Apollo_

Safety isn't a problem if you look badass


Masterdavis

Then look badass, not like a bulimic mech


casulti

I’ve never been a huge fan of rear skirt armor that doesn’t move/gets in the way of mobility, so I’d make an adjustment to that.


Drakostheswordsman

It does move though. The MG has a double butt flap.


KamenKnight

Head Vulcans. Sure, maces, warhammers, swords, etc. are cool/very useful but, you're not always going to be able to use them. For example: Say you're clashing swords with someone else. You see that their neck is a nice weak point but, since you're clashing with them you can't take advantage of that. *But* with head vulcans you can! Plus, head vulcans are good back up weapons when the enemy is close and you can't draw your weapon faster than they can strike.


DapperCrow84

You can still have head vulcans on an IBO Gundam, just not in the frame. You just have to keep the weapons and ammunition between the frame and the outer armor. Which is a good thing as it makes reloading and repairing easier and makes crippling ammo explosions less likely. Gundam frames are a lot like a tanks hull. You can put what ever weapons and armor you want on it, as long as the hull/frame can support the mass or energy needs.


KamenKnight

Aren't the Head Vulcans built into the frame of the OG Gundam (and other Gundams)? As that's what I was manly drawing from, when I made my suggestion.


DapperCrow84

Sometimes yes, sometimes not, the thing is IBO is the only timeline that defines a Gundam by its frame so a lot more emphasis is put on it than other timelines. As for the original Gundam I'd say no the head vulcans are not in the frame itself, as then all RX-78 variants like the Gundam Ground Type EZ-8 Cammand unit would also have head vulcans in the same location but it does not. Their are strengths and weaknesses to both when it comes to head vulcans and putting the guns in the frame. It does give them more protection, but it makes both matanense and upgrading the guns a lot more difficult as you now have to take apart the frame as well as the armor. In world war 2 this turned into a big problem for the Germans as too much stuff that broke down too easily were put deep into the hulls of the tanks making repairs a big problem. And if the ammunition is also in the frame then it runs the risk of the ammo cooking off and exploding in the Mobile Suit instead of outside or in a compartment that can be vetted if there is a fire due to an enemy hit. If you seen a picture of a destroyed tank with the turret blasted off it this is what happened to it. As for IBO and head Vulcans in the frames. Considering that they were not built to fight anything with infantry and what they were built to fight heavily used beem weapons which can cook off the ammo it's a good choice no to Build them in the frame. Now as for why Tekkadan didn't upgrade the Barbados with them I can only guess that either ammo is too expensive (their is some dialog in the first episode that implies this). Or its just a oversight because they are a bunch of kids, and the Turbins are basically smugglers not soldiers.


xwrecker

I’d also say the waist as it kinda looks easy to sever


Xeith913

The damn discs that cover the hip joints in HG kits. I mean those golden one in the picture, or the back of them depending on how you build the kit. They're held in place by some really large and plain stud and they fall off All. The. Damn. Time.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

It’s s o i r r i t a t i n g


Corpse-Hands

To be honest I love the IBO designs, it got me into gundam and are super cool when compared to the earlier shows. It gives a sense of a society thats a bit more technologically advanced


MS-06_Borjarnon

I think it's particularly neat how the technology isn't depicted as just a straight-line improvement, but as actual, practical machines that people have different understandings of and uses for. Makes them feel a bit more 'real', like, you can imagine the oil and grime that'd wind up on your hands when working on them.


plodeer

A specially designed cup holder for the cockpit that never spills the drink for the pilot. They’re in these mechs for a while and no place to put a beverage.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Best upgrade ever


Psidebby

Just give the pilot a helmet upgrade where you fuse it with one of those novelty beer helmets.


RacerM53

Normal feet


Boyoboy7

Nothing I guess, the frame is stong enough to take on punishment form the likes of Hasmal and Dainsleif to keep on fighting, that is a lot better than most of other MS frames from different era. The slim design is meant for the Gundam to have great mobility because they are meant to be used to fight MA in close combat. I prefer giving it new equipments or weapons.


Loafmanthebutcher

I always thought the legs and feet were too lanky/long compared to the torso. but the upper body looked so sleek which i thought of was off compared to the bottom half


Senpai_Likes-hentai

So make it a tad bit smaller?


Loafmanthebutcher

slim them down a bit, maybe reduce the size of the knees. the feet i see are large, maybe thats just compared to many of the other UC suits though. similarly, reduce the front toe area i guess


nedmaster

You ever seen an inner frame by Mamoru Nagano? I'd mix in a bit of his little details in there


Senpai_Likes-hentai

No I haven’t actually, feel like I’ve missed something really important


nedmaster

He was the designer of the Hyaku Shiki, the Quebely, and rhe Rick Dias. As well as the lead designer on Heavy Metal L-Gaim and Brain Powered. And he created the five star stories. It's hard to describe how I'd have him do a Gundam Frame from IBO just find an image of a Mortar Headd inner frame and mix it with a gundam frame.


SaturnRocketOfLove

The posture


MS-06_Borjarnon

I want to see more *weird* ones, like, humanity's pretty much up against the wall in the Calamity War, right? So I want to see how far people would push the designs, what their desperation would drive them to. Also, given that we've only seen one MA, I'd like to see MS specialized to fight other, different sorts of MAs, in different environments or circumstances or whatever. Edit - Ooh, or, I'd like to see more that have been repurposed in the centuries since the war.


rezerxle

Hard same dude I wanna see more super specialized MS like flauros. Although I'd much rather see more Mobile Armors I'll take what I can get.


MS-06_Borjarnon

> Although I'd much rather see more Mobile Armors I'll take what I can get. Yeah, they're a really neat idea that would be interesting to see explored more.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Imagine all the ma’s awaken and all the existing frames left gang up to fight them, it would be soo cool


Redstar96GR

Make it look even more like a skeleton,just for the spook value.


UzumakiJinn

If they do that, they are just stepping on Evangelion's toes than they already are.


Mehdzzz

For barbatos I'm not a fan of his knees and thighs. And the other suits on tekkadans team are very generic. I wish they were more unique. I know some have cannons and extra arms and what not but they're just a little boring.


NitroChaji240

Like everyone else says, the waist. It's really cool looking, but it looks like a single Vulcan round would incapacitate the entire MS. I also think it'd look cooler if they had inverted knees, like in Zone of the Enders. It'd differentiate them from other MSs a bit more, and would look cool as hell


The_Cur8tor

The waist for sure


UzumakiJinn

This is always such a sensitive topic, too many IBO fan boys/girls wanna downvote you cause you said something about their favorite show. Overall I have no complaints with the design of the suits. The issue I have is, what makes this a gundam? Is the frame made of gundanium? Also the torso presents an obvious weakness. A skilled pilot with a rail gun or a big enough sword would and should aim for that, cleave it in half and move on.


barringtonp

What makes any mobile suit a Gundam? Gundanium is specific to Wing. Gundarium, nano-laminate, phase shift armor, something-something GN particles, most series have their own name for plot armor. IBO plot armor isn't as strong as most...


Muisverriey

Well, it's a Gundam because the frame is called a Gundam Frame. That's it. In-universe the lore is that these are the only frames able to run two Ahab reactors parallel to eachother.


UzumakiJinn

I mean I knew the frame was the actual "Gundam" but it just never made sense why it was called a gundam. In nearly all the other shows the armor was made of Gundanium. Didn't know about it being the only frame that could use two Ahab reactors. It's been a while since I watched the series.


UnitaryBog

I think only the UC and after colony timelines used gundanium or gundarium, and even then not every mobile suit made out of the special alloy was called a Gundam


DapperCrow84

Gundanium is only used in Wing to define what a Gundam is. Their is no consistent definition of what makes a Gundam a Gundam, sometimes even in the same timeline. For example if you use the material that the armor is made of as the definition then The Gundam Ground Type from The 08th MS Team is not a Gundam, as its not made from Luna Titanium like the original Gundam.


Muisverriey

It could be made out of Gundaniam here too. The material it's made of is never explained in the show.


Machdame

The rules are reflected in the series. In this case, the frame itself. Even in UC, it's fairly arbitrary. You just need to pop the V fin and faceplate to get "it's a gundam!" All that can be said is that it is up to the writer. Use Kamen rider rules. They can look wildly different and still be riders by different rules because they don't share rules. That being said, it's a design universal to IBO. All IBO frames have a single connecting waist joint that seems oddly un-armored.


UzumakiJinn

Like I said in the original post I love the design from a mecha point of view. I have no complaints about that. The IBO suits and story line are good. It just never really felt "Gundam" to me. There was just such a huge departure from the standard Gundam ascetic that it looks like it should be it's own independent mech anime. And yes I'm aware that all AU Gundam series had their own looks and takes on the franchise, but with the exception of G they all held similarities to what a gundam traditionally looks like. This is just my opinion and I'll stand by it. The other thing I don't particularly care for is the fan base of IBO, based on past interactions when stating how I feel about this.


Machdame

But that's the thing though, I'm stating the objective interpretation. They are "gundams" because they are written as such. Gundam has always been an arbitrary name, but what it means is usually in the subject of the series. It doesn't get more arbitrary than the Turn A when is largely a name given to it with no other meaning. "Gundam" as a moniker in general is not universally treated the same and really should be understood as such. Opinions aside, they say they are gundams, so they are gundams.


UzumakiJinn

I'm not singling anyone put in particular, they can call it whatever they wanna call it. I'm merely stating that when compared to other iterations of gundams versus other mecha anime, my personal feeling is that IBO falls more into the other mecha category. Same as G Gundam falls more into line with super robots than a traditional gundam. I've never watched Turn A but from what I've seen of some of the designs I would feel iffy on them as well.


Machdame

With respect to the breadth of types covered in the entire series, IBO isn't that far out there. There have easily been types that have comparable elements and it's not even the first of its build. The Throne Gundams and the Arche predate it in addition to the Physalis which is a very atypical design. That's just the low hanging fruit. Relative to the rest, IBO gundams look pretty distinct, but clearly still within the series design space.


t3hm3t4l

I think IBO looks good enough, but I hate that they create all these AUs and slap a Gundam label on them to sell toys, at first they at least looked like “Gundams” and now they’re starting to veer off of that. I wish they’d just stick to the Universal Century. That said, Gundanium only exists is Gundam Wing’s universe (AC). There’s no such thing as Gundanium in any other universe, not even in the universal century. In the UC, the RX-78 Gundam’s armor (and Guntank and Guncannon) was made of Luna Titanium Alloy, it was a new, experimental, super durable, super light alloy developed on Luna II by the EFSF scientists. It was later branded “Gundarium” after the success of the RX-78-2 Gundam. The next generation of Prototype “Gundam” Suit created after the OYW was the RX-178 MK II, uses Titanium Alloy Ceramic Composite which isn’t even a Gundarium variant. There were other iterations of Gundarium: alpha (recreated Luna II Titanium alloy by Axis engineers), Gundarium Beta, Gamma, Epsilon which were all iterations varying in durability and weight and Gundarium Ceramic Composite which shows up in later UC because it is lighter and works better on the scaled down mobile suits as maneuverability becomes the main focus of mobile suits in the future, but it’s not as durable as earlier versions. All of these versions of this alloy are used on various other models of mobile suit. After the Gryps conflict nearly every prototype or high performance mobile suit is made of Gundarium of some kind. So I shared all of that to say this, Gundam means nothing. It’s the name of the first hero mobile suit featured in the original anime. That’s what it is, that’s what it means. Outside of that, Sunrise determines what is or isn’t a Gundam and that’s the only qualifier.


socialistconfederate

You can't fix perfection


ASWG29

Make them immune to dainsleif too, not just the armor


MS-06_Borjarnon

Is the armor immune to dainsleifs, for some reason I'm recalling it being more that they're resistant to beams. If dainsleifs are analogous to crossbows, it'd make sense for them to be able to pierce through armor, though that analogy might only go so far.


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Senpai_Likes-hentai

I guess it’s more how to make it more practical


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azakukai

So whats wrong with liking “practical” designs


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azakukai

This isn’t a fixed post it’s just how would you change the design to be more appealing to you pretty much


somekidwithinternet

My only problem with it is the waist putting a little armor to it would make it better


thatsnotacracker

That pointy gold piece on the chest. I know it's part of the cockpit/probably offers protection to the pilot, but I just... something about it how it juts out just bothers me.


DapperCrow84

That is a real problem with the design, it draws fire. And considering it's right above the cockpit and in front of the reactors you probably don't want it to have a shot me here spot there.


Krosis_the_bored

only it doesn't draw fire as it's covered by armour


lumberjackben

Dual crotch mounted grenade launcher only accessible while unarmored.


ihateentiteldmothwrs

The waist cuz I broke it while building the MG


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Pain, I broke the clip for the shoulder…


ihateentiteldmothwrs

I’ve had the damn thing for 3 months and still haven’t fixed it completed it


Adventurous-Focus-92

Crab claws.


Xerdo1

Maybe make it a bit more hunched over , and give him more chicken legs with elongated arms , and it should be good


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Basically make it bayverse star scream? Without the dorito torso lol


Xerdo1

Well , kinda , the head is very nice , I think a bit more hunched over look would make it more imposing , with a bit longer arms , so it'll balance the legs , which with a little bit of chicken action would make him faster. But the dorito torso would be tasty


Gran-Blue

I'd turn those shoulder circles gold to match the hips


gntotoy

See how the whole torso is like a cylider that holds everything, maybe give that part the abilty to purge the head, lower torso & lower arms into a scape pod like the ball shaped scape pod on UC timeline to save the pilot & combat data. But the cockpit is always the main target might be worthless if the pilot is dead before he could activate it


Deep-Host-3257

Make the feet just a bit bit bit smaller


BoyishTheStrange

For me to have one


RygartArrow7777

if i could, i would thicken up that fucking spine in some way, add some nanolaminate armor on that shit ​ replace the ball type fucking hip joints in the legs. theyre horrible. ​ but honestly if you take away the design for the torso it would just be another alternate universe gundam. and besides, if youre good enough of a pilot, you would be damn protecting the torso anyway cuz youre literally in there. take a shield. armor is good, but even more protection is... better. you know what fuck it, take two shields, and put two swords underneath em and have them swing out. be a fuckin grimgerde


Foxyloxyfox86

OH my goodness. Looks just like C-3PO from the phantom menace. This is going to be in my nightmares.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

I can’t unsee it now


Zer0tolorance

Tiny ass stomach


MannyManity

Shorter toes, longer thighs, redesign way the shoulder attaches to the torso, and add cup holders.


DakotaGunpla

Make a PG Barbatos.


Christochat

Probably the monsterous feet


sylpher250

Needs more MGs


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Y e s


xSylvanas

the waist, looks too fragile


Longinus1999

I mean, aesterically it is somewhat pleasing, but the whole thing looks like it's going to crumble on it self


Senpai_Likes-hentai

At least it doesn’t look like the bay verse transformers, those “things” look like they can crumble at any given time


FakeUserDetected

There are these pistons between the shoulder and the neck, get rid of em. The don't so anything and just look weird. On the model kits their not even connected to anything on the end going toward the shoulder.


Krosis_the_bored

May I present to you the MG Barbatos


Corporate_Punk

The heel of the foot always bothers me


No-Bee-459

There's two things I would change: \- Remove the claw-like parts of the feet. They just don't look right. \- Reinforce the waist section. I don't mind the joint being exposed, but it looks so fragile.


QiarroFaber

I wouldn't really change anything. For a kind of 'skeletal frame' it definitely looks the part. And I like the idea.


AceSkyFighter

I really don't have a problem with the frame. It's just the skeleton of the mobile suit. It's the exposed waist piston that drive me nuts. I enjoy a lot of the IBO mechanics. But that exposed waist drives me coo coo for coco puffs. It's worse than the Jestas in Narrative having little night vision goggles in the ridiculous department.


The_Haunted_Boo1954

I’d add a bit more of the beige throughout the body.


Imperialgenecist

A little more around the chest waist everywhere, and remove the giant codpiece.


drew_silver202

I wish Bandai would make a HG naked ibo frame.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Would be really cool


unprofesionalbee

Neck and lower torso, its basiclly sceaming: "hit me here"


TheNoobThatWentRee

I would add a machine that makes lunch


Senpai_Likes-hentai

Gotta prioritise the pilot!


InevitablyPerpetual

A massive robo-dong. For the techno-fiddler demographic.


xwrecker

Replace the torso/waist joint with the standard one or something more durable especially with how flimsy it kinda is for the model kits


MrWillyP

The torso needs a little thickening, it's a clear structural weakness, that if exploited, would have catastrophic consequences. Other than that I absolutely love the art decisions in IBO


Kingleonidasinsparta

They're supposed to be lightweight versatile frames. We have those swappable Armors for a reason. I ain't changing anything.


Uden10

Bit of a bandwagon answer, but the torso could use more support. Outside of that I'd make the whole thing a tiny bit thiccer to match the aesthetic of some of the box art, but that's a nonissue all things considered. The frames are near-perfect as is.


Mecha_Bagel

Id make the frame more colorful.When all of the detailing on the frame is in the Same general color, it makes it harder to notice and makes it pop less


VARice22

Damn near nothing, first series for me and its currently in my top 5 favorite anime of all time. You could say I'm biased.


Senpai_Likes-hentai

It’s my second series actually!


McBrownRice

more pipes and wires on the chest


dooti8472

Add an Solar Funace, add 10 more engin, and add an la+ system (joking)


amx-018

Make it full psycoframe


Honorbound980

Two things: 1) alter the proportions of the thighs and shins so that the thighs aren't ridiculously short, 2) do the same for the biceps and forearms, and most importantly, 3) replace the lower torso piece with a spherical connector like on the Build Burning Gundam.


Krosis_the_bored

MG Frame canon appearance


AbbreviationsHefty75

Nothing. The designs are fine.


jakob736

Normal feet instead of tactical space heels